I’m not going to lie to you, my first thought when I saw this was that bit in the new Golden Axe show where the main villain rides the titular golden axe like a witch on a broomstick (high pitched cackle in front of the moon and all) and I snorted. Not sure if that’s a niche reference or what but go watch golden axe, it’s such a good time.
I don’t think any power on this planet is capable of *killing* the Void Dragon. You’d need something on his same scale, and that fight would tear the world asunder. It sounds like the plan is to have Dainix gain enough power to transmute all VD’s substance into Light Dragon and channel it into the Lady. I don’t know whether that would actually destroy VD’s subjectivity or just leave him as a powerless ghost, but either way…
Or fuse the two halves back together, maybe? Because something about this situation and the way the magic works kind of feels to me like draining one dragon to empower the other would set something pretty badly off-balance, and that’s never a good thing.
Media and pip culture has all sorts of examples of balances of power that get disrupted due to people meddling and why that turns out to be a Very Bad Idea, and these two in particular beg the question: we see that happens when Void gets out of control, but what about Light? And that had been on a relatively small scale–on the scale of a very force of nature? I don’t think that could end well.
Which… Oh, now that could be interesting. I dunno if it would be a bit cliche or not (it probably is), but it would certainly prove an interesting development…
I think he laid it out pretty clearly. He wants to change its nature. I doubt he thinks he could ever be completely transformed into light, nor would he be so short-sighted as to believe that to be desirable, but he almost certainly wants to find a more productive balance between the two.
In other words, he wants to give the void dragon a redemption arc.
And to be honest I’ve been on that wavelength for a while now.
Every fantasy story involving gods has to involve some group who wants to destroy the world and start over. Turning the Light Dragon into the Void Dragon would be a first step.
Okay, we now finally see some of Tahraim’s game. It’s like his plan for Dainix is to use him to transmute the Void Dragon (or, given the sparkly wisp we saw in 2.3.40) transmute both the Void and the Light Dragon into a secret third thing.
On a side note, I find it funny that Caliban is calling Tahraim a child given they’re only a few centuries apart in terms of age. But this and Caliban calling the Rakhnan ignans “our people” is further evidence I’m gonna put in my “Tahraim was ignan and the one who first invoked Fire’s truename” folder.
Ok Tahraim being an ignan but somehow stronger and immortal, perhaps like an emissary of Caliban would be interesting. Do we have any other examples of immortal powerful emissaries?
He is supposed to be a smith god though no? So… is he like a city god but his people are all the smiths and perhaps artisans? So he doesn’t necessarily need a city? I’m confused, but Erin did say that belief could create a deity, and therefore has enough power for something like this. Probably.
Also where on earth do we get any info about their age difference? I mean I guess they are both at least centuries old. Red’s post or something?
Emissaries are in Aurora are all a very specific thing. They are mortals with a soul linked to a god in some way. You can’t be an emissary to multiple gods at once (e.g. be an emissary of both Caliban and Tahraim, it’s either one or the other), and being a mage and being an emissary are mutually exclusive as well.
Tahraim is a conceptual god. He’s higher on the power tier, because his domain encompasses a concept rather than a location, a city or a people. Conceptual gods as a whole are grander and less tethered to mortal due to the breadth of their domain. Tahraim is also the exception to how gods normally form on Aurora, because he’s the only god to have once been a mortal.
As for age difference, it’s a simple inference. Caliban has been around for as long as ignans have been a thing, which is 4000 years at the bare minimum. The First Invocation of Fire’s truename most likely occurred sometime in the 24th century given Rakhn’s recollection (for the record, the current year in Aurora is 6182, so 62nd century). To my knowledge, Red hasn’t stated when exactly Tahraim first incarnated, but if he was in fact the ignan mage who deciphered Fire’s truename, it would by virtue of chronology place him as Caliban’s junior.
Makes me wonder, if someone had a big enough ego, could they make themself a god? Or a god copy of themselves? I’m not saying that’s what Tahraim is, the “our people” thing is probably due to some overlap in their domains.
I don’t think there’s a secret third thing. Tahraim just said “one dragon into the other”, not “both dragons into something else”. The plan is to siphon Void into Light and leave VD powerless if not entirely eliminated. If there IS a secret third thing, I don’t think Tahraim knows about it.
Caliban probably needs Dainix as a protector of some sort maybe (?), but I think Tahraim is just in it for the love of the game. He just wants people to reach their full potential as he sees it, to temper and mold them (at least I think)
I almost wonder if, because Caliban seems to be the god of the Ignans, they want Dainix to be an example that “See? It’s not actually terrible to be able to turn into a firey ball of fury!” to the rest of them, thereby changing their perceptions and preconceived notions, which gods are vulnerable to.
Tahraim is a craftsman, looking at raw materials and already seeing the sculpture inside the marble, so to speak. He definitely doesn’t really care about the mortals for themselves, but he also seems to have friends and a certain sense of justice, see him crafting that soul extractor thing for the Collector and then using it on Tynan, the Storm.
It seems like he night be the only one in the group besides Erin able to access the higher properties of Fire, including Transmutation. Erin can’t transmute the Void Dragon while possessed, so they need Dainix to do it. Now I’m wondering if it’s even possible to Transmute a God. What would happen to his consciousness?
I’m not certain on this but they’ve referred to Dainix as a weapon several times so my money’s on Caliban needs him to fight something, or just wants a weapon in general. Quite possibly a similar deal to Ody and Athena in EPIC.
Is calian older than tahraim? I guess it makes sense that ignans developed before the idea of craftsmanship, but tahraim just seemed like a wise, older mentor type.
With ire Caliban roars “This is not a game!”
A war is no different for us says Tahraim
“I said we won.” Found is the dragons’ shared state
The Crucible he’ll temper, they just need to wait
How curious… Funny how this supports Stephan’s statement that the war with Walter is paramount, yet at the same time reveals there are more sides that he is aware of.
I love the detail of Caliban’s cape! Usually it’s slightly on fire. But on these last two pages the cape isn’t burning. Instead it looks like ashes on the wind.
“Our people are not pawns to be sacrificed” as if they lowkey haven’t been treating Dainix like a pawn without giving him any information. No hate to Caliban and Tahraim but also with shade lol
I knew at least some gods must’ve known! I love how Caliban looks so much like a ghost with their cape. It makes a lot of sense he could turn into a crucible too. I appreciate that it doesn’t seem like we have enough information to reach an objective consensus on what they want to use Dainix for. We know a lot, but there are still some pretty big players whose goals we just don’t know yet, aspects of the world completely hidden. I’m glad we have more mysteries to gnaw on for the foreseeable future.
With that said, they totally want to have Dainix become powerful enough to transmute the dragons into the secret third thing. Cut the existential terror in the bud and kill the last primordial. I wonder if they know another one recently woke up.
Reminds me a lot of the Licanius Trilogy. Dialogue that seems ominous and weighty initially, and enormously significant with the benefit of hindsight and context later. I look forward to getting that context.
So Erin’s going to have really cool powers and a dark evil side. Got it.
I don’t know Erin was basically going to be the heavy hitter for the team, but I’m down with that. Guy’s got every magic and will have dragon powers. Sure. XD
I think Tahraim is referring to Dainix, not Erin, when he says “He’s obviously still too small and weak, but he’s becoming what we need him to be.” The Crucible has always been his project, and Erin is already a powerhouse with an Evil Superpowered Dark Side.
Oh man, these two gods have a plan to get rid of the Void Dragon. Or at least turn it into something that doesn’t want to eat the stars. This might also explain why the Void Dragon said he killed Fire first, cause Fire had the ability to change what he was. But after seeing the Paladins in action and acting for the Light Dragon, I’m not sure having two Light Dragons around would be any better. And Consumption is such a core part of being human, I’m not sure losing the Void Dragon in the center of the world would be any better for people. This has a great chance to go horribly wrong for everyone.
It’s kinda neat to see Caliban get so… Shall I say… Heated?
But fr, they’re usually kinda chillin and being a ragebaiter for others, so it’s cool to see them so riled up at the thought of Tahraim not taking the lives of their people seriously enough
You know, there’s something to be said about these gods that usually act on big agendas actually having some anger to spare for the sake of their people. Like all these events are beyond mortal scopes, and yet it doesn’t take away the value of mortal lives.
Oh… these two are at war with the dragon(s).
I wonder if Stefan knows just how right he was when he said “there’s nothing beyond this war.” Even these two are involved!
“How many did YOU lose” “OUR people are not pawns to be sacrificed.” I sense no discrepancies with potential for arguments within. Seriously though I’m very curious about how much Tahraim actually cares about people beyond their ability to grow and change.
Well, damn. That’s one hell of a loredrop, right before I head out the door. “The two dragons are one”? I don’t think this has been anything but a highly-plausible fan theory up until now, has it?
Read the conversation between Erin, Dainix, & Falst in the cave when they first regrouped after being shipwrecked. It has been explicitly confirmed before now.
Sorry I didn’t comment sooner.
I didn’t feel like staying up super late to read the page and then I got distracted by school.
Anyway, it’s killing me that I can’t read Aurora fanfic. I hate it.
-Signed The Vessel Of A Glowing God
(aka The Princess)
Have a theory that Tahraim and Caliban may have been involved with what happened to Vash. Now I think it was just Tahraim. The fact that The Collector choose the one city god who uses star metal in their avatar feels too coincidental. Tahraim is clearly up to some long-term planning. End goal appears to be dealing with Void in a more permanent way.
Right, because “We’ll turn the BAD balanced force into ANOTHER GOOD force and then we’ll have two whole Goods and no Bads” is always a sentiment that goes over well.
Assuming that’s what we’re doing at all.
All powerful gods trying to mould heroes into doing their bidding without telling them the whole story to irrevocably and immensely alter the world, no way this doesn’t have unforseen consequences. They are doing something everyone should be on board with and making every enemy possible along the way.
For mobile readers.
Alt-text: last time on Dragon Ball Z…
Image source: wait
Tumblr text: Plotting and scheming oh my!
Bluesky text: and a very good morning to all of you
WOULD YOU LOOK AT THAT THEY BOTH LOOSE THE PONYTAILS!!!
this looks so cool. The theory gears are spinning
Tahraim pretty ckearly dtill has hus ponytail
Maybe ‘both’ is refering to Dainix and Caliban, since those two are the only characters we have seen turn into Crucible/Demon form
A slow afternoon.. very funny
Well, Erin did have a slow afternoon that he spent theorizing off-screen. It’s just that everything thereafter wasn’t slow.
he makes that hammer look so comfortable
I’m not going to lie to you, my first thought when I saw this was that bit in the new Golden Axe show where the main villain rides the titular golden axe like a witch on a broomstick (high pitched cackle in front of the moon and all) and I snorted. Not sure if that’s a niche reference or what but go watch golden axe, it’s such a good time.
Tahraim doesn’t seem like he’d wish to kill the VD. I wonder what his goal is.
I don’t think any power on this planet is capable of *killing* the Void Dragon. You’d need something on his same scale, and that fight would tear the world asunder. It sounds like the plan is to have Dainix gain enough power to transmute all VD’s substance into Light Dragon and channel it into the Lady. I don’t know whether that would actually destroy VD’s subjectivity or just leave him as a powerless ghost, but either way…
Or fuse the two halves back together, maybe? Because something about this situation and the way the magic works kind of feels to me like draining one dragon to empower the other would set something pretty badly off-balance, and that’s never a good thing.
Media and pip culture has all sorts of examples of balances of power that get disrupted due to people meddling and why that turns out to be a Very Bad Idea, and these two in particular beg the question: we see that happens when Void gets out of control, but what about Light? And that had been on a relatively small scale–on the scale of a very force of nature? I don’t think that could end well.
Which… Oh, now that could be interesting. I dunno if it would be a bit cliche or not (it probably is), but it would certainly prove an interesting development…
I think he laid it out pretty clearly. He wants to change its nature. I doubt he thinks he could ever be completely transformed into light, nor would he be so short-sighted as to believe that to be desirable, but he almost certainly wants to find a more productive balance between the two.
In other words, he wants to give the void dragon a redemption arc.
And to be honest I’ve been on that wavelength for a while now.
Every fantasy story involving gods has to involve some group who wants to destroy the world and start over. Turning the Light Dragon into the Void Dragon would be a first step.
Okay, we now finally see some of Tahraim’s game. It’s like his plan for Dainix is to use him to transmute the Void Dragon (or, given the sparkly wisp we saw in 2.3.40) transmute both the Void and the Light Dragon into a secret third thing.
On a side note, I find it funny that Caliban is calling Tahraim a child given they’re only a few centuries apart in terms of age. But this and Caliban calling the Rakhnan ignans “our people” is further evidence I’m gonna put in my “Tahraim was ignan and the one who first invoked Fire’s truename” folder.
Ok Tahraim being an ignan but somehow stronger and immortal, perhaps like an emissary of Caliban would be interesting. Do we have any other examples of immortal powerful emissaries?
He is supposed to be a smith god though no? So… is he like a city god but his people are all the smiths and perhaps artisans? So he doesn’t necessarily need a city? I’m confused, but Erin did say that belief could create a deity, and therefore has enough power for something like this. Probably.
Also where on earth do we get any info about their age difference? I mean I guess they are both at least centuries old. Red’s post or something?
Emissaries are in Aurora are all a very specific thing. They are mortals with a soul linked to a god in some way. You can’t be an emissary to multiple gods at once (e.g. be an emissary of both Caliban and Tahraim, it’s either one or the other), and being a mage and being an emissary are mutually exclusive as well.
Tahraim is a conceptual god. He’s higher on the power tier, because his domain encompasses a concept rather than a location, a city or a people. Conceptual gods as a whole are grander and less tethered to mortal due to the breadth of their domain. Tahraim is also the exception to how gods normally form on Aurora, because he’s the only god to have once been a mortal.
As for age difference, it’s a simple inference. Caliban has been around for as long as ignans have been a thing, which is 4000 years at the bare minimum. The First Invocation of Fire’s truename most likely occurred sometime in the 24th century given Rakhn’s recollection (for the record, the current year in Aurora is 6182, so 62nd century). To my knowledge, Red hasn’t stated when exactly Tahraim first incarnated, but if he was in fact the ignan mage who deciphered Fire’s truename, it would by virtue of chronology place him as Caliban’s junior.
Hey, Mat? I might be missing something, I’ve read this comic a few times but I’ve forgotten things before, how do we know Tahraim used to be mortal?
I don’t think it’s been confirmed in the story, but Red has mentioned that Tahraim used to be mortal on Tumblr. Hope that helps!
Woahhh?? Then that means Gleicann’s statement that mortals and gods are fundamentally different is wrong??
Makes me wonder, if someone had a big enough ego, could they make themself a god? Or a god copy of themselves? I’m not saying that’s what Tahraim is, the “our people” thing is probably due to some overlap in their domains.
I don’t think there’s a secret third thing. Tahraim just said “one dragon into the other”, not “both dragons into something else”. The plan is to siphon Void into Light and leave VD powerless if not entirely eliminated. If there IS a secret third thing, I don’t think Tahraim knows about it.
Is that what Dainix needs the fireseed shard for too?
Aurora Question #71: What do you think these two need Dainix for?
Caliban probably needs Dainix as a protector of some sort maybe (?), but I think Tahraim is just in it for the love of the game. He just wants people to reach their full potential as he sees it, to temper and mold them (at least I think)
I almost wonder if, because Caliban seems to be the god of the Ignans, they want Dainix to be an example that “See? It’s not actually terrible to be able to turn into a firey ball of fury!” to the rest of them, thereby changing their perceptions and preconceived notions, which gods are vulnerable to.
Tahraim is a craftsman, looking at raw materials and already seeing the sculpture inside the marble, so to speak. He definitely doesn’t really care about the mortals for themselves, but he also seems to have friends and a certain sense of justice, see him crafting that soul extractor thing for the Collector and then using it on Tynan, the Storm.
It seems like he night be the only one in the group besides Erin able to access the higher properties of Fire, including Transmutation. Erin can’t transmute the Void Dragon while possessed, so they need Dainix to do it. Now I’m wondering if it’s even possible to Transmute a God. What would happen to his consciousness?
I’m not certain on this but they’ve referred to Dainix as a weapon several times so my money’s on Caliban needs him to fight something, or just wants a weapon in general. Quite possibly a similar deal to Ody and Athena in EPIC.
Is calian older than tahraim? I guess it makes sense that ignans developed before the idea of craftsmanship, but tahraim just seemed like a wise, older mentor type.
With ire Caliban roars “This is not a game!”
A war is no different for us says Tahraim
“I said we won.” Found is the dragons’ shared state
The Crucible he’ll temper, they just need to wait
I agree, Caliban, waiting sucks. Especially waiting for a new chapter…
How curious… Funny how this supports Stephan’s statement that the war with Walter is paramount, yet at the same time reveals there are more sides that he is aware of.
I love the detail of Caliban’s cape! Usually it’s slightly on fire. But on these last two pages the cape isn’t burning. Instead it looks like ashes on the wind.
Omg I didn’t even register that until I saw your comment!
Yo, Caliban’s just like us at the end of every chapter.
This seems like a relevant time to mention my Dainix is a Baby God theory
Oh???
The literal embodiment of fiery temper.
“Our people are not pawns to be sacrificed” as if they lowkey haven’t been treating Dainix like a pawn without giving him any information. No hate to Caliban and Tahraim but also with shade lol
I knew at least some gods must’ve known! I love how Caliban looks so much like a ghost with their cape. It makes a lot of sense he could turn into a crucible too. I appreciate that it doesn’t seem like we have enough information to reach an objective consensus on what they want to use Dainix for. We know a lot, but there are still some pretty big players whose goals we just don’t know yet, aspects of the world completely hidden. I’m glad we have more mysteries to gnaw on for the foreseeable future.
With that said, they totally want to have Dainix become powerful enough to transmute the dragons into the secret third thing. Cut the existential terror in the bud and kill the last primordial. I wonder if they know another one recently woke up.
Good Job!
Reminds me a lot of the Licanius Trilogy. Dialogue that seems ominous and weighty initially, and enormously significant with the benefit of hindsight and context later. I look forward to getting that context.
“Oh… I have ADHD.”
Same Caliban, same.
Did Caliban call Tahraim a child as in he is litterally a younger god then her? Or that he’s acting like a child? Or did she do neither of those??
So Erin’s going to have really cool powers and a dark evil side. Got it.
I don’t know Erin was basically going to be the heavy hitter for the team, but I’m down with that. Guy’s got every magic and will have dragon powers. Sure. XD
I think Tahraim is referring to Dainix, not Erin, when he says “He’s obviously still too small and weak, but he’s becoming what we need him to be.” The Crucible has always been his project, and Erin is already a powerhouse with an Evil Superpowered Dark Side.
Oh man, these two gods have a plan to get rid of the Void Dragon. Or at least turn it into something that doesn’t want to eat the stars. This might also explain why the Void Dragon said he killed Fire first, cause Fire had the ability to change what he was. But after seeing the Paladins in action and acting for the Light Dragon, I’m not sure having two Light Dragons around would be any better. And Consumption is such a core part of being human, I’m not sure losing the Void Dragon in the center of the world would be any better for people. This has a great chance to go horribly wrong for everyone.
Woah, he’s planning on turning Walter into another white dragon????
It’s kinda neat to see Caliban get so… Shall I say… Heated?
But fr, they’re usually kinda chillin and being a ragebaiter for others, so it’s cool to see them so riled up at the thought of Tahraim not taking the lives of their people seriously enough
Tahraim’s laid back attitude scares me sometimes, but I love his and Caliban’s sibling energy :p
These two interacting is gold. They’re a little bit of asshats, and a lot bit of fantastic.
Also the aaaaart~~~!
If I could burst into flames whenever I was angry at someone I fear I might pose quite the fire hazard
“Our people”?
So he was definitely an Ignan before his apotheosis.
OUR people? Is Tahraim also an ingnan? Or was?
Is is canon that he was human before or have I just thought that for so long I forgot
I think it’s canon.
You know, there’s something to be said about these gods that usually act on big agendas actually having some anger to spare for the sake of their people. Like all these events are beyond mortal scopes, and yet it doesn’t take away the value of mortal lives.
Yup, Caliban blew up. Called it! Although an actual Crucible form wasn’t what I was expecting (for some reason.)
“I hate waiting.” lol. So do we, so do we. Do you KNOW how long we waited for these pages to come out?
I FINALLY caught up! Now I’m sad because I have to wait. 🤣 Alinua just wants her man back.
Oh… these two are at war with the dragon(s).
I wonder if Stefan knows just how right he was when he said “there’s nothing beyond this war.” Even these two are involved!
“Child”?! Huh. I guess Caliban’s a lot older than I thought, and/or Tahraim is a lot younger than I thought! Learn something new every page!
I found that interesting too. I guess it makes sense? Forgery is a much newer concept than the Elder Races and their variants.
Huh. That was a very Crucible-esque transformation there from Caliban.
“How many did YOU lose” “OUR people are not pawns to be sacrificed.” I sense no discrepancies with potential for arguments within. Seriously though I’m very curious about how much Tahraim actually cares about people beyond their ability to grow and change.
Well, damn. That’s one hell of a loredrop, right before I head out the door. “The two dragons are one”? I don’t think this has been anything but a highly-plausible fan theory up until now, has it?
Read the conversation between Erin, Dainix, & Falst in the cave when they first regrouped after being shipwrecked. It has been explicitly confirmed before now.
for a split second i was like “wait when did dainix get here??”
Sorry I didn’t comment sooner.
I didn’t feel like staying up super late to read the page and then I got distracted by school.
Anyway, it’s killing me that I can’t read Aurora fanfic. I hate it.
-Signed The Vessel Of A Glowing God
(aka The Princess)
There’s Aurora fanfic on…
…wait.
The waiting is excruciating, but it makes it all the more worth it.
Oh my gosh caliban with her hair down is absolutely GORGEOUS I love them so much
Ooh? What did Erin unravel?
Have a theory that Tahraim and Caliban may have been involved with what happened to Vash. Now I think it was just Tahraim. The fact that The Collector choose the one city god who uses star metal in their avatar feels too coincidental. Tahraim is clearly up to some long-term planning. End goal appears to be dealing with Void in a more permanent way.
Panel 4: Anthropomorphic firestorm
Panel 5: Androgynous & Glowy
No in between/transition
The two genders
Right, because “We’ll turn the BAD balanced force into ANOTHER GOOD force and then we’ll have two whole Goods and no Bads” is always a sentiment that goes over well.
Assuming that’s what we’re doing at all.
All powerful gods trying to mould heroes into doing their bidding without telling them the whole story to irrevocably and immensely alter the world, no way this doesn’t have unforseen consequences. They are doing something everyone should be on board with and making every enemy possible along the way.
I KNEW IT! I KNEW IT! THE FIRE DEITIES KNOW THE TRUTH!