2.3.37
on December 23, 2024
at 3:00 am
you are now leaving the Non-Diegetic Fire Zone, please leave a five star review if you were satisfied with your divine wisdom
Aurora
A fantasy webcomic. Updates M-W-F.
you are now leaving the Non-Diegetic Fire Zone, please leave a five star review if you were satisfied with your divine wisdom
interesting… new info acquired
For mobile readers.
Alt-text: me when there’s a charcuterie board on the menu if I’m being honest
Image source: crucible
Tumblr text: and welcome back!
. “To the Dragon, hunger is fundamentally selfish. It clings and devours and is never satisfied. It doesn’t even know what it’s so desperate to have. If you let this form of hunger poison you further, it’ll devour you from the inside or reshape you into its own insatiable image.
. “When you fought it, you transmuted its attacks as they passed through you. Nicely done, by the way. Excellent reflexes.” Tahraim smiles, resting his hammer across his shoulders. “But if you want to get this stuff out of you now that it’s taken root, you’ll have to learn how to do that on purpose.
. “Reach inside yourself. Touch the Void and feel the potential the Dragon neglects.
. “Is destruction innate to the material of hunger, or is it just the form that hunger has shaped itself into?
. “Melt it down. Burn away all traces of its past forging and transmute it in the crucible of your soul until you refine its purest form. And when you hold the essence of hunger, stripped of pretense and pride–”
. Dainix looks up, seeing Falst standing on the deck a few feet away, the fire-space gone, as Tahraim’s last words echo in his head.
. “I wonder if you’ll recognize the feeling?”
Tumblr text: and welcome back!
The Smith God encourages to refine Void
See the truth that is more than destruction deployed
Thinking about the last panel, and now I wonder: Is the essence of hunger desire? Or want, or whatever pretentious word we use? ‘Cause the implication is that it has something to do with how Dainix feels about Falst. (Desire in this case in whatever form, so for Dainix maybe something like the desire to help Falst.) What do y’all think?
The thought crossing my mind is that the core element of hunger might be *nutrition*. After all, it’s been heavily implied that the missing element that the Void Dragon has implanted in living creatures, but which is missing in homunculuses created from the six elements known to most mages, is the ability to incorporate new matter into themselves in order to maintain their bodies.
Walter interprets that purely through a selfish lens – “I will make everything into part of myself” – but providing nutrition to others might also be within the domain. Furthermore, given that each of the well-known elements has a physical manifestation and a metaphysical one, it’s possible that Walter doesn’t just represent physical nutrition, but spiritual nutrition. Which could include things like friendship, caring for others, and being cared for when needed.
If it turns out that the Soul Monks CAN help with the Void Dragon, that might be part of the key – a mystical organisation (that isn’t already dedicated to some other entity) might be sufficiently in tune with their own spirituality to be able to invoke that side of the ‘hunger’ domain.
this has made me wonder if perhaps a mage who figured out void magic (or maybe a light mage? we still don’t know what light magic is at its core, and i’m very curious if, since dainix seems to be able to transmute it into void, perhaps it and void are sort of. the two sides of hunger?) is the one who made the ferin? and that’s why ferin are like. able to grow and reproduce, unlike homunculi. if i’m remembering the lore about ferin correctly, anyway.
I think it’s been implied that the Light Dragon is the one that gave people self-determination, so something related to that or thought is probably Light Dragon’s metaphysical concept. Which explains the crowns being the approach for non-lethally shutting people down – basically pausing the gift she gave to their ancestors.
I agree with Draxynic, I think at its core hunger is the need for something.
The Void dragon doesn’t see that because he is too proud and arrogant to need anything, so he simply takes everything he can and destroys it. But without that presence, needing something becomes as simple as asking or accepting help. I think Tahraim’s implication is less about Dainix’s desire to help Falst being similarly to hunger, but rather that the feeling, needing help and connection, is something Dainix would be familiar with by seeing it is Falst. Likewise in the same way he helped Falst, Falst is now here to help him.
I think I agree with this. But I’d like to take it one step further. As far as we’ve been shown, the Void Dragon IS the Void, like the other primordials and their elements. If he doesn’t understand something about the Void, it means he doesn’t understand himself. And it might not just be the potential of the power he doesn’t get.
“It doesn’t even know what it’s so desperate to have.” I think the Void Dragon is too proud and arrogant to know WHAT he needs. What if he’s secretly lonely, needing connection and belonging, but he interprets that need as a desire to consume? Maybe that’s even deep down why he put himself into living beings: to be a part of something.
Was Void the Power of Love all along? I must say that would be hilarious.
I laughed. If this ends up confirmed, I’ll probably laugh harder
Same.
Walter’s been pretty much alone or with enemies for most of his existence, so it’s entirely possible that the only love he knows is a twisted form of self-love.
I generally think of hunger as a feeling that signals need, so yes, I agree with folks who think it’s something similar here: a feeling of need or desire–maybe desire, by the broader definition of hunger instead of the narrow need-to-eat-to-stay-alive definition. I actually like your choice of the word “desire,” because something clicked for me there. I can extrapolate from that!
If void is hunger, and hunger is desire (for food, help, connection, anything), then I think I see how void can be transmuted to light. Light seems to be an element of willpower–we saw that Falst tapped into it unintentionally when he was strongly driven to help Dainix, and again when he was hellbent on breaking free of the diadem. If a person desires something, that gives them a purpose, a goal to strive for. Willpower is, by definition, the drive and determination to achieve such a purpose. Willpower is born from desire. Will is desire as conscious decision. Hunger is desire as instinct. Maybe the key to transmuting one to the other is understanding that connection.
That’s my two cents, anyway.
Void being desire might also explain some of the stranger behavior Kendal exhibits.
He contains neither Void nor Light (neither dragon could affect him) and thus doesn’t really desire anything. He lives to fulfill an external purpose and is really distraught whenever that purpose is not apparent because he might have no inherent internal desire to do anything
panel 1 “It doesn’t even know what it’s so desperate to have”
Hear me out lore guys, the Void element’s true form is the despair of going out with friends but no one knows what they want to eat
I laughed uncomfortably loudly at this, too loud for 4am. *glances around*
SCP (insert number) is now coming for you.
Ah, that’s sweet.
Tahraim’s the sort of deity to see a world ending threat and ask ‘is anyone gonna redeem that?’, then actually wait for an answer because they’re genuinely interested.
I susspect he also sees Dainix as Fire being reborn or maybe just recovering as an avitar / personification.
Light and void are the same. Erin was right, there is no eigth element. Anything the void dragon can do the light dragon can, because they are equal and opposite.
Both are, I think, wanting, needing and aspiring towards something. Where Void scrabbles for scraps, Light reaches for the stars.
This is such an amazing theory and it’s worded so beautifully, I wish there where like buttons on comments
“Where Void scrabbles for scraps, Light reaches for the stars” OMG THAT’S SO POETIC
Poetic but -motions to the void dragon literally trying to eat stars- not accurate. I think they are onto something but I don’t think that’s the difference between them.
To be fair, I think voidy’s reaching for the stars too. (They taste good and he’s hungry.)
The demuncher not being able to make constructs or connect to sapient minds and the paladin’s patron’s lack of ability to break anything and lack of burning properties kind of pokes a hole in that.
Metal and Rock have several conflicting properties as well, but they’re both part of Primordial Stone. Perhaps Stone also had multiple personalities that each hated each other without realizing they were the same entity all along?
Do they really have any major differences?
I don’t know what makes a “major” difference to you, but from what we can see/assume in the comic:
Metals are malleable while rock is brittle.
Metals are shiny while rock is non-reflective.
Metals conduct electricity while rock doesn’t.
The dragon hungers, to kill everybody and destroy everything that exists. The crucible hungers for something else. Fire is often seen as destructive and violent, and this opinion is not incorrect, however fire is also a beacon, it is warmth and light, and helps to protect that which you love. And sometimes, the answer is right in front of you. *Winks*
It’s 5:00 am it’s too early for this cryptid crap AND YOU AREN’T HELPING! -Sulkily sips hot chocolate- also if that logic is correct I’m pretty sure the philosophic lesson of the day is that desire isn’t bad. Literally just replace hunger with desire and would you look at that. Well it kinda works. You made two points about hungering then one about how fire can protect which is like me going “collector desires to have souls, Kendal wants to save everyone, and did you know Kendal has starfire” which feels very off topic.
Is the feeling love? Is that what it is? Is that the divine wisdom? The power of love? I’m good with it; I just want to know.
Some say love, it is a hunger
An endless aching need
I think ‘desire’ is more to the point. Love is one kind of desire, as is hunger, but there are many. The Void Dragon only sees it as hunger because he’s too selfish and prideful to accept that he might, on a deep level, *need* a connection to others, so he twists it into destructive consumption instead.
I don’t think that means the light dragon (or any other pure elemental, like Life) lacks needs or desires, but it might suggest that entities that don’t have void in their makeup don’t have an innate psychological need for connection and community.
Tahrim is implying that Void is an impure form of hunger, and that Dainix can melt it into it’s pure form. He also implied that he’s already done it on reflex before. This means that Void is actually an impure form of Light, rather than both of them being direct equals. I’m incredibly intrigued by the implications of this in regards to both VD and LD’s creation though. If LD is the pure form, then what happened to birth VD?
Also, throwing my guess into the mix, I think hunger might actually be protection/preservation. We see LD’s whole thing be protecting others, and hunger serves to replenish and preserve a body. Side note: I wonder if we’ll get to see Dainix sharing this wildly scientifically important thing with Erin, and if so, how long it will take until both of them have a chance to talk about it. My guess around Halloween 2025 when they are recovering from the assault of the Collector, which is assuming any of the protagonists get to catch their breath within the next 5 chapters
The paladins seem more about getting rid of anything Void related than protecting. The Lady is perfectly willing to kill anyone if it slows down the dragon some.
Wait so if void is the element that love is derived from (or at least sexual love) is that why Kendal is ace?
No. No it is not. Kendal is ace because he’s ace. There doesn’t have to be a deeper meaning.
What? What are you talking about. Why would someone write that?
1) No. 2) I get where you’re coming from, but. No.
What? Wait, where did you get the idea that void is sexual love? Now I’m confused. Also no, Kendal is ace just because he’s ace. There doesn’t have to be anything deeper than that.
That would imply being ace makes you less human, and that everyone with Void wouldn’t be. From a doylist perspective, the former feels uniquely cruel, given that Red is herself ace, and I expect the latter will be disproven over time.
I was also going to joke that according to this comic, Void/Hunger – Destruction = Lust. I doubt that it’s actually true though. That would imply that Kendal is Ace because of metaphysics, and also that anyone else who is Ace is somehow devoid of void (or resistant to it? its a spectrum thing I guess) Which would be a weird, kinda cringe way of having someone’s sexual orientation effect a magic system, but it would also be a bit narcissistic from this particular author and really not tied into what this story is about.
Now to lama past aught that is nay fire. Ooooooooowwwwwwwwww.
Might we all just take a moment to appreciate those waves in the background?
I wonder if we’re going the same route as the “true meaning of greed” in the last chapters of FMA
That’s the same thought I had…
Tahraim continues to be peak
Dainix: … I feel … the festive spirit of Brennsday?
Tahraim: … Eh, close enough.
So, his transmutation of that Void in Zuurith was an instinctual response to being attacked? That makes sense, and explains why his interaction with Void now, with him being the attacker rashly transmuting a Light shield, is so different.
This whole conversation has me convinced that Tahraim’s forging of Dainix for Caliban is still ongoing; encouraging him to get out of prison himself was just part one of many. Next part: upgrade his transmutation power from subconscious instinct to conscious intent.
An entire element and higher property with untold potential to shape the world and how people live their lives, and all V.D. sees it as is a means for him to devour stars. Tahraim has said before how he hates waste, and I’m betting he must hate how V.D. squanders this power. I wonder if he may be secretly excited by the possibility of a Void mage in Erin.
Now there’s an interesting thought. Is L.D.’s essence transmuted Void into a new substance, or is it a purer version of what Void could be if not under the control of V.D.? It could represent bodily hunger, but could it also be longing for companionship, family, to want experiences shared with others and to share back? One feeds the body, another the mind and soul. Maybe L.D. awoke the mortal wills not in spite of Void present in them, but because of it.
Void could be like any other element, only as good or evil as the wielder, were it not for V.D. still exerting his influence on it. Probably just as well Life is keeping a mostly hands-off approach to her element.
Aurora Question #30: What are your personal feelings on Tahraim and his character?
I love Tahraim! I feel like he plays the role of the almost-always-absent-mentor to Danix, and mentors nearly always end up being my favorite characters. He knows stuff and is mysterious about it but still tells Danix (and us!) all kinds of fun things. And like all fun characters, he’s mysterious 🙂
10/10 he’s great and 1 of my favorites. Riddles are fun! Sometimes! Some days I’ll probably won’t to punch him in the face but I’m pretty sure that’s just part of the experience of loving the cryptic mentor. So he’s perfect really!
He’s weird, but not weird enough for me to like.
Tahraim and Vash are neck and neck for my favorite god characters, and Tahraim is just a bit further ahead. He’s consistently funny, is one of the most mysterious characters because he knows quite a bit about the Dragon, and (if I’m getting this right) he is the only mortal to have become a god. Also his first scene with Dainix, specifically the part about burning away rage and guilt, is probably my favorite Dainix scene.
10/10 love that guy
I love Tahraim! He’s honestly one of my favorite gods in any media I’ve ever consumed. Especially paired with Caliban? Best duo. I’ve always been drawn to smiting gods for some reason, and the fact that he’s also taking on a bit of a mentor figure (like @somone who loves dragons said) just makes it better!
Tahraim might be my favorite character in this series. The mixture of “helpful, empathetic, and calm under pressure” with “stubbornly cryptic and infuriatingly useless” makes him incredibly charming to me. I’m so happy every time he’s on screen.
I also find Erin’s sheer hubris and scholarly moments highly entertaining, and the existential crisis Life presents makes me insane. The other party members are amazing characters (Kendal is my third favorite fantasy swordsman of all time), but Life, Tahraim, and Erin typically shuffle as my top three Aurora characters.
I think he’s an interesting and fun character with a penchant for cryptic but insightful advice. He can be obtuse, but I quite like him and especially like his interactions with Dainix. 🙂
I’m starting to believe that even Red is shipping Dainix and Falst.
… just now?
They’ve blushed at each other a couple times (well, Falst has at Dainix), and they had a little misunderstanding in one of the downtime chapters where Falst, blushing, apologized for holding Dainix’s hand. I would be very surprised if Red was not making them a ship.
They should kiss after this
They deserve hugs tomorrow
Ah yes, hungry for cat-boy. A common emotion we are all familiar with.
Hunger is fire
Hunger is just wanting something and needing it at the same time, and that seems pretty fair to me.
Lust is
Thank you, sniper.
I definitely agree with what some other people have pointed out, that void represents want of some kind, not just hunger. Since the Light Dragon and Walter are opposites (or two sides of the same coin), maybe void is the want to protect yourself, and light is the want to protect others? I’m not 100% sure right now, but I’m excited to see what happens next in the comic. Tahraim was cool, there’s possibly a big sea snake thing fight coming up, Dainix and Falst are getting good screen time, the floof squad is at the volcano island place – overall, very exciting.
Transmutation, I think. Growth and change. Creation. Hunger is lacking something, and feeding it is transmutation.
Fire is already transmutation.
Attraction, the (potentially) less destructive form of fire.
Didn’t Red say somewhere that fire is transmutation, not destruction? Unless you meant to type void there instead of fire?
WHERE’S THE NEXT PAGE I WANT THE NEXT PAGE WHY DOES THIS FEEL LIKE A CLIFFHANGER I CAN’T WAIT THAT LONG?! (Take your time Red, I’m just getting excited now)
It’s love isn’t it?
Falst is reaching out to Danix…. I think void dragon is desire
So Tahraim (enigmatic smith god) keeps referring to the Dragon as “it” and this confirms the Dragon in question is light one. This seemed off to me as I was pretty sure the Dragon was a she (the void Dragon seems more like an it), but on reflection (going back over a lot of comics) I think Kendal has a prophetic inkling that “She is coming” before the Champion/Paladin shows up. The Champion is by his bio a he, but there is of course the mysterious Lady Huracan, who may also be acting as an intermediary between the light Dragon and the Paladins including the Champion. Lady Huracan is a she (but also a they). So maybe Tehraim’s pronoun is correct or maybe he’s just a jerk who can say?
Per the character page, the Void Dragon is “He/Him, They/Them”; the Light Dragon doesn’t have a character profile, but, the paladins consistently refer to the Light Dragon as “Lady”.
That said, the word “it” in this page refers to the Void Dragon; “when you fought it, you transmuted it’s attacks” refers to when Dainix fought the Void Dragon in Zurith, in one of the many “Kaiju Fights” of that arc – it is never discussed in text (until now), but if you go back and look at the art, whenever the Void Dragon blasts Dainix with void, some of the assault is transmuted into flashes of white light, which Red acknowledged (on Tumblr, I think) was explicitly meant to be recognizably neither Fire nor Void, but some separate substance (which we now strongly suspect is Light).
Hhhhhhuh.
Interesting…
Does that imply that the Light Dragon is devoid of love?
MA’AM YOU CANNOT GO AND ALT TEXT *THAT* INTO ‘me when charcuterie’ LIKE BWH—– AKSDBFKL;AJSDGHFH
Bit late to the party.
So, my thoughts:
1. From the fact that he’s here, I think we can fairly safely say that Tahraim witnessed the fight with the Champion, ergo he knows about the light Dragon. He also knows about Dainix’ fight with void Erin, i.e. the Void Dragon. Yet he refers to only one Dragon here, and refuses to use either of their established pronouns, instead calling this Dragon an “it”. We can be fairly certain that the Lady has the exact opinion about hunger that Tahraim describes here, from how she described Erin’s mind breaking down over time before the fight.
2. Tahraim talks about transmuting void into its pure form. We know Dainix made this void in him by touching a light shield, and the attack he talks about having transmuted turned into flashes of light. There’s pretty much no other possible conclusion than that light is transmuted, purified void.
From those two things, I think Tahraim believes Lady and Void to be the same dragon, and I’m inclined to agree. Similar to how both metal and rock, despite wildly different properties, are both part of Primordial Stone, they’re both (unaware?) parts of one Primordial Hunger. In an alternate universe, there might an evil Rock Dragon and a good Metal Dragon fighting over the fate of the world.
3. So, what happens when you purify void/hunger and turn it into Light? I believe the expression “hunger for knowledge” would be pretty fitting. Dainix obviously knows that feeling, the entire reason he agreed to come with them (hell, the reason he left home at all) is because his whole life’s purpose right now is to learn as much as he can about being a Demon, and Erin suggested the Soulshapers might have answers for him. It also fits with the Paladins, besides fighting monsters, spending most of their time archiving knowledge from all over the world to the very best of their ability. They’re hungry, outright starving, except not for sustenance.
Ah yes, the other form of hunger… *thirst*
I wish there was a way to like comments
So *that’s* why his transformation is called a Crucible. Huh
I hate to bring MCU into this, but all I can think about with Falst reaching out to Dainix is the “Lullaby” bit between Scarlet Widow and Hulk.
Now kiss
Well said
Sorry still can’t get over the giant cartoon hammer
TL;DR: Divine intervention
My guess is inspiration or sonething like that.
I assume this isn’t going to happen, but I think it would be cool if Dainix starts trying and failing until the whole boat gets swallowed up by the leviathan chimera beastie and then he’s finally going to succeed because he has to save Falst.
Just my random musing.
I’m… starting to think that Tahraim might be more than a conventional god. He knows a lot about the nature of Void and the Dragon, things that other people and gods (Tynan for instance) often don’t know. When Vash needed a weapon, Tahraim just happened to have a starmetal ingot and a mysterious gemstone… it’s just a hunch, but from what we’ve seen in the comic Tahraim may be something older/more knowledgeable than other gods.
Desire, I think what comes out of the crucible is desire
Tahraim continues to be the MVP…
twitter/Bluesky text: it’s been a confusing day